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RSTuning
10-14-2007, 11:51 AM
What if anything is going to be done about it? So many people askig for bullduckduckduckduck kwp this galetto that, not one of the registered users is vetted before given access leaving the whole place open to numpties and freeloaders.

We need a place to discuss PROFESSIONAL chiptuning related things and i for one will not discuss anything on this cattle market!

I'm sure 90% of our legit members will agree with this so it's about time to do something about this

If not i propose a new forum run by the member for members. Not having to worry about how many google hits!

iobdtune.com
10-14-2007, 11:56 AM
yes they have just to legally buy the tools and then they have the support from the maker of the tool

rhitk
10-14-2007, 12:38 PM
What if anything is going to be done about it? So many people askig for bullduckduckduckduck kwp this galetto that, not one of the registered users is vetted before given access leaving the whole place open to numpties and freeloaders.



You forgot to mention the latest hype; duckduckduckduck removal.

I fully agree, we must have a new place with some checking done before one gets admission to it. But having said that I realise that somebody has to start up a new forum and we need moderators and so on. But it's like always easier said than done. I neither have the knowledge nor the time to start something like that.

Dazza
10-14-2007, 12:59 PM
What if anything is going to be done about it? So many people askig for bullduckduckduckduck kwp this galetto that, not one of the registered users is vetted before given access leaving the whole place open to numpties and freeloaders.

We need a place to discuss PROFESSIONAL chiptuning related things and i for one will not discuss anything on this cattle market!

I'm sure 90% of our legit members will agree with this so it's about time to do something about this

If not i propose a new forum run by the member for members. Not having to worry about how many google hits!

Yes I agree with you 100% as this is damaging the whole industry, Im getting calls from customers asking why I cant offer remaps@£100 all inc and then telling me that they can buy the "real" equipment from fleabay with 45,000 tuned files etc etc... Maybe VAT numbers, proof of original hardware purchase and such will be the way forward for this forum? As it stands its a free source of information for a lot of get rich quick fleabay merchants and "I have a friend...." threads. I also think duckduckduckduckb removal SHOULD NOT be discussed at all on an open forum for obvious reasons!!

roet
10-14-2007, 02:17 PM
Absolutely agree with this, this forum is going down in this way, there will be no more serious talk if we continue like this, only ebay-guys with cracked software and OBD-cables from China and idiots trying to steal cars with our help.

There should be a professional section at least, not some sort of macho-trip about who is best (like the german-forum), but only people with registered tools/software and a company number, all other info like website and so on known to the owner of the site.

Just my 2 cents.

dj_spark
10-14-2007, 07:09 PM
Agree about duckduckduckduck thing and needed support for cracked software, but for true enthusiast there is nothing : it's all about hype and making money... :rolleyes:

CTW John
10-14-2007, 11:13 PM
This was always designed as a place for tuners, even the arses who were on the other forum as moderators kicking their competition off have joined here and think no one knows who they are(quite funny) not sure what to suggest as on the old forum software I could control it as I had admin rights but on the new software only have moderator rights. Difficult to judge as many who want to be moderator abuse the position for business as well

vwmike
10-15-2007, 12:10 AM
What about the advanced section that nobody ever uses? It looks like it's been almost 2 months since the last post.

DFMSWEDEN
10-15-2007, 01:24 AM
The best solution that we have, is to make a "vip" sektion !

And vbulletin are very easy to setup ...I can help if needed !!

Regards
DFMSWEDEN

fastguy76
10-15-2007, 05:39 AM
Best way is at new users registering admin should ask user questions and the users position at chiptuning. Or as told before vip section for the pro users.


regards

kisslorand
10-15-2007, 09:00 AM
This will never work. I've been on some forums right from their begining, they all ended up with thousand of useless users, and trillions of useless posts.

RSTuning
10-15-2007, 09:34 AM
Of course it will work. As above really, it depends on who is moderating the forums and if they have time to check. A start would be to delete ALL the newbie looking to buy cheap tool threads, lock down registrations and ban some of the freeloaders!

vwmike
10-15-2007, 10:24 AM
When I first came on here the forum couldn't be viewed if you werm't registered. This meant that our every word wasn't out there to be found in google. I understand that the people who run this forum need to be able to generate revenue by getting hits through the search engines and that is somewhat at odds with what people are comfortable with here. So, until this changes I don't think you're going to see the changes you're looking for.

TDC
10-15-2007, 10:46 AM
Charge a large annual fee & raise it if it dont filter out enough wasters..

The fee *may* balance out the potential lost revenue from advertisers who no doubt benefit greatly from newbies realising they need real, genuine supported kit..

I'd guess the forum is at a stage where Pro's are holding back sharing knowledge for fear of freely educating free lunchers ! - which is sort of the opposite of forums are about ?

Anyway - I'd pay £100 happily.. this forum has been priceless for me ..

fastguy76
10-15-2007, 10:50 AM
The best way is to ban and delete users with the questions that re opposite of forum rules. and to check every user that register new. These needs time and work progress and so admins re busy i think. or automaticly delete these threads will keep forum clean..

fastguy76
10-15-2007, 10:52 AM
Charge a large annual fee & raise it if it dont filter out enough wasters..

The fee *may* balance out the potential lost revenue from advertisers who no doubt benefit greatly from newbies realising they need real, genuine supported kit..

I'd guess the forum is at a stage where Pro's are holding back sharing knowledge for fear of freely educating free lunchers ! - which is sort of the opposite of forums are about ?

Anyway - I'd pay £100 happily.. this forum has been priceless for me ..


And also a price for joining this forum is good too. ıt will keep cheapers off.
this can be good too

dj_spark
10-15-2007, 11:18 AM
What is a cheaper ? Someone who can't/don't want to afford expensive tools ?
What I understand in here is that you don't want people that are doing this as a hobby or club/team activity...

If some of you know pgmfi.org (strictly Honda), there are free tools, shareware ones and license too. The only thing that is prohibited down there is people asking for other to "make a bin for me yo !!!". It's all about learning how to do thing, and you can do it with any tools that you want (free or $$$), with time and trials.

For my personal case, I don't do chip copycat or chip sitting at my bench, I do street and dyno tuning, so each car is specific for me. I see many people that bought generic chip or file (made by some Pro tuners :) ) calling me to fix their car running like duckduckduckduck.

Is it the right place for me or should I go somewhere else ?

DFMSWEDEN
10-15-2007, 11:19 AM
The only solution is a "VIP" area, there pro´s can discuss anything, and of course that area have to be controlled by admins and moderator to get this work !

We have vip areas since 2004 and no one gets in that area, but if some vip member nominates a person, and he get access to the vip areas !!

It dont have to be a problem at all.....just do it and find out how well this system works !!!!

Regards
DFMSWEDEN

vwmike
10-15-2007, 11:22 AM
The only solution is a "VIP" area, there pro´s can discuss anything, and of course that area have to be controlled by admins and moderator to get this work !

We have vip areas since 2004 and no one gets in that area, but if some vip member nominates a person, and he get access to the vip areas !!

It dont have to be a problem at all.....just do it and find out how well this system works !!!!

Regards
DFMSWEDEN

The VIP area already exists but nobody uses it!

I don't think most of you can actually see that forum section but it is there.

CTW John
10-15-2007, 11:32 AM
It needs more admin involvement

vwmike
10-15-2007, 12:06 PM
The admins still haven't managed to get the oridb working for everyone.... I'm not sure they're too interested anymore.

fastguy76
10-15-2007, 12:14 PM
It needs more admin involvement

Yes Extremely right

diga-tec
10-15-2007, 09:24 PM
You can not imagine, how many requests for a free test file come every day. And for testing, its always the "own" car. Asking what tool is used to read, the answer is 99% KWP2000. Company is always going to be registered soon, no VAT number and a yahoo email adress...So buying a 100 Euro tool and trying to get a free file.
Sorry, but NO WAY.
Finally i see exactly these people here asking for help and guess what: they get help. For free.
Can anyone explain me why there is a need to explain a new member with less than 5 posts how to remove a speedlimiter in a brand new ECU ??? And if the file is not working why do some offer to correct the checksum for free???
Dont get me wrong - its ok to help. But not to anyone that you will never hear of again after he got his car tuned for free and next day offering "professional remaps" on eba...
Some here do the right thing in my opinion: give no answers to these guys or absolutely useless answers - like they deserve it. But there is always somebody who must show how fantastic he is and gives infos that do not belong to any normal end-customer.

CTW John
10-15-2007, 09:28 PM
yeah I get the same people asking for demo software or hardware, I'd be broke if I gave out anything demo for amount of requests

roet
10-15-2007, 09:43 PM
There should be a limit to access the forum, (only tuning) company registration number required, customernumber for editing software, those kind of things.
If you have these things you show you take this serious and plan to do something in this business, than you can enter (with or without any knowledge, that's not the point). In that case it is easy to see who is, or is going to be a professional and separates this from the clowns asking for free files or help trying to tune/kill their own car (in both cases it's noth healthy for business and only helps in giving it a bad reputation).
End-customers do not belong here, you can't tune your own car, it's easy as that.
If people want an "duckduckduckduck-off" that should not be a problem every now and then, people with legimit business do not steal cars a lot, if it's for a project you sometimes need this to be done, post a picture from your project or tell what you're doing, we all like projects, in this way it's abovious what you need it for every once a while.
You don't need an duckduckduckduck-off twice a week i guess.

There are lot's of car-fanatics boards on the net, those are for customers, chiptuning-business is hard enough as it is, no need to kill it ourselves by letting customers see what exactly is happening and fighting each other here.

This forum should be tuners only in my opinion, in this case you know knowledge is exchanged between professionals, not some "cheaptuners" collecting enough info to make an ebay-dvd.

My 2 cents.

Stage-R
10-15-2007, 10:44 PM
+1

The forum is not a joke, but one can't go deep into discussion of technical data knowing that millions of unworthy people will read

vwmike
10-15-2007, 10:57 PM
You all have valid points. Most of the time when I have a problem I cannot resolve I will talk to the people on my MSN list rather than post here because I find that often those who have the answers won't answer me on the forum. It is usually only in desperation that I post hoping I get a PM with an answer. Most of you don't know me, but I think it's obvious at this point I'm not going away so I do get some answers. I do think it could be better though if people were more free to speak on here.

fastguy76
10-16-2007, 09:04 AM
The only solution is a "VIP" area, there pro´s can discuss anything, and of course that area have to be controlled by admins and moderator to get this work !

We have vip areas since 2004 and no one gets in that area, but if some vip member nominates a person, and he get access to the vip areas !!

It dont have to be a problem at all.....just do it and find out how well this system works !!!!

Regards
DFMSWEDEN


Yes thats a good solution too..

As i think %10 or 12 of this forum are professionals. so vip section will be a good solution for this raito.

RS4biturbo
10-16-2007, 10:27 AM
This was always designed as a place for tuners, even the arses who were on the other forum as moderators kicking their competition off have joined here and think no one knows who they are(quite funny) not sure what to suggest as on the old forum software I could control it as I had admin rights but on the new software only have moderator rights. Difficult to judge as many who want to be moderator abuse the position for business as well


John, you've always been such a fool... now ban me if such is your wish.

T-POWER
10-16-2007, 11:03 AM
Hello guys,
we must stop to talk about it, we need to handle now!

1.- user get access only wth complete registration
(Name, adress, city, country)

2.- registration diference between: Pro-, New-tuner or End customer
Pro: Customer number from any company (evc, cmd, bs and so on)
The pro tuner can get access to the "vip" area
New: only read a part of the forum
End customer: only request about tuningfiles
( duckduckduckducki tuner asking in this area for support will be deleted without any comment)

This sistem works in other places too and it works

Greetings
T-POWER

RSTuning
10-16-2007, 12:55 PM
Hello guys,
we must stop to talk about it, we need to handle now!

1.- user get access only wth complete registration
(Name, adress, city, country)

2.- registration diference between: Pro-, New-tuner or End customer
Pro: Customer number from any company (evc, cmd, bs and so on)
The pro tuner can get access to the "vip" area
New: only read a part of the forum
End customer: only request about tuningfiles
( duckduckduckducki tuner asking in this area for support will be deleted without any comment)

This sistem works in other places too and it works

Greetings
T-POWER

+1, totally agree

Paul

fastguy76
10-16-2007, 01:30 PM
Hello guys,
we must stop to talk about it, we need to handle now!

1.- user get access only wth complete registration
(Name, adress, city, country)

2.- registration diference between: Pro-, New-tuner or End customer
Pro: Customer number from any company (evc, cmd, bs and so on)
The pro tuner can get access to the "vip" area
New: only read a part of the forum
End customer: only request about tuningfiles
( duckduckduckducki tuner asking in this area for support will be deleted without any comment)

This sistem works in other places too and it works

Greetings
T-POWER


Agree too . + 10

custom-chips
10-16-2007, 11:27 PM
Well, I think everyone has its own sight of this problem.

I think an anual payment is not the right way for people that have some knowledge. Would it be logical to pay for spreading informations? The other thing is that everyone who pays for something will await something. I don`t know if it is the right way.

A VIP-Section is normally a good solution. But be true - waiting for a nomination will probably beeing the same effect as waiting for the first understandable "wife-ecu" :D. I would prefer a small test. For example Changing the Vmax to a specified value, changing the Ignition of a not so often used ecu to constantly 30degrees or something, changing the knock-sensor of the 3d cylinder or something like that. Not something what every map-copier can do but something that shows, someone knows at least some basics or has his own experience by driving with a simulator beside some other informations. As longer as someone is in the buisness, as more as he knows, as less it is interesting to share the own education with someone else without getting back something.

So, I would even say, you need 2 expert-section: One with a VIP-Section (where a good knowledge should be the key for entering besides using original hard and software) and a professional-section for people earning their money with chiptuning and using legal tools.

And about that clone-clowns, a registration procedure with manual selection will be a good solution (checking if it is a existing firm for example etc.).

RS4biturbo
10-17-2007, 12:03 AM
has his own experience by driving with a simulator beside some other informations

Stop dreaming, less than 5 people on here have ever done that!!!!

admin
10-17-2007, 02:06 AM
hi all...

Changes can be done to improve the forum. For me there is no problem with disabling most of the site from Google and other search engines and have this forum available only for professionals.

I had some improvements planned for the next month, and have asked some help with that..

Disabling this website from search engines, will now have to be asked the current sponsors. Maybe they are not interested to keep on sponsoring the website. So maybe there are some options:

1. Most of the areas get private, and users will have to pay a fee to access them. If real chiptuners don't want to read all that newbee stuff, they will have that option.

2. A private area could also be implemented. I can have moderators with more privileges to manage all the stuff. Most of the forum will keep the same. Threads will keep being deleted.

well there are more...you already mention some

But...today I had problems with my main website and do not know what is going to be the future. Maybe I will have to start with a new domain all from scratch. Because this website support most of the server costs...So please give me a few more days and with the help of the moderators we will solve this stuff.

vwmike
10-17-2007, 06:45 AM
If anything, I think the answer lies somewhere in the middle. The advanced area makes a lot of sense but there is no need to hide the entire forum from the search engines.....only some areas so people can discuss things in a semi-private manor.

T-POWER
10-17-2007, 06:58 AM
Stop dreaming, less than 5 people on here have ever done that!!!!


1 of 5 .... ;)

T-POWER
10-17-2007, 07:31 AM
I think sponsor dont will have a problem of taking of this webside from guugle becuase the most asking here are end user with a clone hardware and the feeling they can edit maps by itself.
If we do a strict registration forum the sponsors can prove his know how selling files to people that really understand whats going on.

The idea about a specific question about a non comon ecu is more dificult then you think.
1.- you need to have tested the car with the non comon ecu first to be able to answer specifics questions. (not the answer: I think this is a ignition map).
2.- what happens if this specific car with specific ecu is not available in the country from the tuner requesting access?

The vip (advanced area) will show by his own, who knows and wants to help.
Otherwise we know the most active user and there is no secret to read the post of this users and see who knows and who only write to get post counter higher.

It is true when you say people who knows and have tested hours and/or days on a car that they dont give his know-how just to show they are the man´s. But if this people knows there is a place where people with same level change ideas they maybe will.

Greetings
T-POWER

dj_spark
10-17-2007, 10:47 AM
What are you calling Pro tuners ?
People adding % everywhere in WinOLS and damos files without ever datalog / dyno cars
or
people working in the real world on real car ? (street and dyno tuning) ?

T-POWER
10-17-2007, 11:03 AM
talking to me? :)

dj_spark
10-17-2007, 11:23 AM
To anyone, since the beginning of this post I read Pro and non Pro, so who is what ?
I knew lot of guys around me that have expensive tools and can't tune a car, even if they paid the license.


The tool don't make the worker.

custom-chips
10-17-2007, 12:30 PM
The idea about a specific question about a non comon ecu is more dificult then you think.
1.- you need to have tested the car with the non comon ecu first to be able to answer specifics questions. (not the answer: I think this is a ignition map).
2.- what happens if this specific car with specific ecu is not available in the country from the tuner requesting access?

The vip (advanced area) will show by his own, who knows and wants to help.
Otherwise we know the most active user and there is no secret to read the post of this users and see who knows and who only write to get post counter higher.

It is true when you say people who knows and have tested hours and/or days on a car that they dont give his know-how just to show they are the man´s. But if this people knows there is a place where people with same level change ideas they maybe will.


No, it should not be a problem, to give someone an original and to find a specified map. If you have done for example several ME7, ME9 or MED9, you will find some things surely again. It is not a proofness, to be able to find something that you do every day. Find it on something similar, then you are surely a step in front. For example: If you are doing many ME7 on VAG try to find the speedlimiter at the Volvos or the maximum-load.


To anyone, since the beginning of this post I read Pro and non Pro, so who is what ?
I knew lot of guys around me that have expensive tools and can't tune a car, even if they paid the license.


The tool don't make the worker.

That`s why I said, two section would be better. One for the legal users of the expensive tools (to have some guide using them) and one for the real programmers.

And btw: I also use often my simulator. At least twice a week. Many people own one, but they don`t use them often. Of course it is less earned, if you spend nearly all the day by doing a simulator-job. But, most of the tuning-files are that old and based on a knowledge, that is sometimes nearly 20years old. There is a big difference in that kind of files and a modern version. Only regarding the economy, every customer will be happy to use less fuel with the same power at that high prices for gas. Or in the diesels to use even less fuel with nearly no smoke at often higher power.

T-POWER
10-17-2007, 12:48 PM
The point here was: NON COMON cars.
For example in my place some cars are not so comon(for tuning) so explane me all maps incl. x,y,z axis scales and the function from every map on a PCM(Ford) and GM(Motorola) and last but not less all limiters too.

Maybe some guy from USA will laught about my example, but he maybe get reall problems trying to tune a european car. or im wrong?

CTW John
10-17-2007, 01:05 PM
John, you've always been such a fool... now ban me if such is your wish.

The funny thing is you don't even know me, you only assume. I have no wish to argue with you, never have. Your enemy is elsewhere these days.

Back to the topic, there are many people on here who do have much experience, more than those who brag, alot. However like everything while it's a public arena they won't speak about technical things in front of customers.

custom-chips
10-17-2007, 01:34 PM
The point here was: NON COMON cars.
For example in my place some cars are not so comon(for tuning) so explane me all maps incl. x,y,z axis scales and the function from every map on a PCM(Ford) and GM(Motorola) and last but not less all limiters too.

Maybe some guy from USA will laught about my example, but he maybe get reall problems trying to tune a european car. or im wrong?

No, not that way ;). If you say you were doing a lot of 1.8T with ME7 for example. Then it would be a good test to change something in a similar ecu, like written above. Of course no one of us could be an expert in some kind of ecu, that he never touched. You can`t be that deep inside EVERY ecu. But that kind of ecu, that someone is doing often, should not be a problem!
It should be a fair test, but not too easy. Nearly every ecu is also built in not so common cars with small differences. Doing the every-day job will not prevent you about people that only copy complete maps from one file to another.
My sense is, that not the one with most bought files from a vip-group should be mentioned, but someone who will bring in some informations ;). I often read in every forum something about a vip-section of people where I can`t understand what knowledge let them become a member of that.

admin
10-18-2007, 12:04 AM
Ok, problems I mention yesterday are solved. Today There was an upgrade on the server, it's now a 2 Quad-core...

So let's keep talking on the changes....and implement them.

Stage-R
10-18-2007, 12:32 AM
Ok, problems I mention yesterday are solved. Today There was an upgrade on the server, it's now a 2 Quad-core...

So let's keep talking on the changes....and implement them.

1) This is only a phreaking flame thread. Close/Delete/whatever...

2) The search function seems a little wrong. for example:
i) Search: "BMW" ---> 0 Results
ii) Search: "BMW limiter ----> 0 Results
iii) Search: "BMW limiter 530d blablabla ----> 20 Results

(this is an example of what i experienced, not true)
I thought it may be on purpose to make more difficult for eb-y ppl :)

admin
10-18-2007, 11:58 PM
stage-R thanks for your input. That problem comes from the current forum configuration. The minimum size of the word was set to 4 characters. Decreasing that number may cause some performance issues, or database size to be bigger. I have set to 3 now, and maybe soon it would be possible to search for BMW. But I will not set to 2 so it can be possible to search for vw :rolleyes: .

Stage-R
10-19-2007, 08:04 AM
stage-R thanks for your input. That problem comes from the current forum configuration. The minimum size of the word was set to 4 characters. Decreasing that number may cause some performance issues, or database size to be bigger. I have set to 3 now, and maybe soon it would be possible to search for BMW. But I will not set to 2 so it can be possible to search for vw :rolleyes: .

LOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOL

Thank GOD you didnt think Lamborghini :D xD